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[Dowser]

[Kayakgirl]

On a final note..

[Ed]

On a final note..

The forum's SMTP server has been load tested if nothing else ;-)
All in all pretty responsive

[Kayakgirl]

I think this should be our Theme tune..

[dean1970]

My comment was fine. You just took it the wrong way. I fully accept your apology. Thank you.

I apologise only for the insult, the remainder of my posts stand.

The fact that a spare torch would have got us out of there was the first thing we realised when we noticed the bag was missing. It's obvious, like pointing out the sky is blue. If you had a head torch, you wouldn't not have a head torch. We get that.

Your post wasn't informative or constructive,it brought nothing new to the thread other than condescension. it was a smug chance to put someone down and engage in a touch of enjoyable posturing.

It had the air of "nobody's kicked them in the nads yet - allow me"

We all know a spare head torch would have helped, but when you've been through something like that, pointless judgement certainly doesn't help, except maybe the ego of the man dishing it out.

If anyone else gets into a tight spot, I hope they aren't put off mentioning it here as a result of this thread, the majority of this forum are supportive and understanding.

A.

Are you carrying anything extra in your pack after this experience?

[dean1970]

And here I am taking the time point something out, but I'm being unhelpful.

[Kayakgirl]

And another..

[Ed]

Are you carrying anything extra in your pack after this experience?

The first thing I did when I woke the next morning was to buy a replacement head torch, a spare hand torch - and a 2 man bothy shelter.

My objection didn't stem from me thinking we had nothing to learn, or change. My reaction arose from the thought that it was a pretty safe assumption our experience had already taught us to carry a spare - and that even if you somehow believed otherwise - your post might have mentioned the torch, or been more specific than general mentions of unpreparedness, or overconfidence.

Given that it seemed clear to me anyone would expect we knew where we went wrong - the only motivation I saw for the post was a good old fashioned dig - or perhaps a little of "that wouldn't happen to me".

If this isn't the case - and you genuinely believed that our experience that night wouldn't have taught us to carry spare torches - it would appear we have little to be arguing about.

A.

[dean1970]

I was not arguing. You should be pleased that someone will learn from your mistakes, not getting your back up.
So, your sorted now. I could go further and ask what would have happened if you couldn't have contacted the rescue. But your only going to take that the wrong way and say I'm being unhelpful.

[Shan Doan]

...pride can be a very dangerous piece of kit...

Wise words.

[Ed]

I was not arguing. You should be pleased that someone will learn from your mistakes, not getting your back up.
So, your sorted now. I could go further and ask what would have happened if you couldn't have contacted the rescue. But your only going to take that the wrong way and say I'm being unhelpful.

Would others not have learned of it without your comment?
Did your comment teach anyone anything new?

As regards contacting rescue, that's an area in which I had some redundancy, with a fully charged nokia brick phone to hand, should my smartphone fail. In the event of a lack of signal at the saddle (where there usually is signal) I might have walked around a little to try and pick some up. The brick phone normally locks on stronger though.

Another thing to note is that people rarely contact mountain rescue without necessity - I'd imagine most MMRT callers response to that question would be "I'd have been screwed". I probably would have been.

I had briefly considered going up Commedagh tight to the wall and trying to take shelter in the summit shelter - but it still would have been touch and go - and I can't speculate beyond that.

A

[dean1970]

I think I made my points quite clear. It's a good example.

So, you thought about getting shelter, but made a decision, not to go for it.

Phones are not reliable, its wet, pissing it down. Your crossing rivers. If your phone didn't work would you have made the shelter.?

[Ed]

I think I made my points quite clear. It's a good example.

So, you thought about getting shelter, but made a decision, not to go for it.

Phones are not reliable, its wet, pissing it down. Your crossing rivers. If your phone didn't work would you have made the shelter.?

Yes, while the commedagh tower would have sheltered me from the rain - it would have provided little heat, and I was already quite cold and exhausted. A stone shelter without a sleeping system might have been dangerously cold for an exhausted individual, and by the time I'd figure out it wasn't for me, I mightn't be capable of securing help.

I may have made the shelter, I may have not. No idea.

Your recent posts give the impression of an intent to educate, so I'll throw my two earlier questions back in here.

In reference to your original post:

This is an example of inexperience, poor planning and just basically not being prepared.
I see it everytime I am up there.

Sorry, I think I am the only one here prepared to criticise. Personally, I think you just got a little to confident and complacency set in.

I am very happy you got down and were ok. Lesson learned.

Do you feel that without the above - others wouldn't have learned from our account of our experience

Do you feel the above has taught anyone anything new?


I honestly think no on both counts, but if you seriously believe the above was somehow educational or helpful - and not a dig as it appears - then we can agree to disagree?

[dean1970]

I am not educating. There are great people that can, I am not one if them.

In my initial post I was actually being quite positive and giving you some credit by saying I thought that you may have got to confident and complacent.

[Oisín]

I'm not going to pass any judgement on MourneMan & Aragorn, because I can't say that I would have done anything different in the situation they found themselves in. And yes I have worded that sentence carefully because they could do nothing about the weather and I don't think a spare headlight would have enabled them to get out of the situation. The problem I took from the post was the crossing of flooded rivers and torrents, not the lack of light to see them.

I also think that even with a bothy shelter they still needed assistance. Shelter or not, wet clothes eventually lead to hypothermia.

Dean, I'm not sure if you were right to criticize the chaps on their actions, you may disagree but I honestly couldn't care less. I think in a situation like that no matter who it involves you should advise not criticize.
Instead of this

Sorry, I think I am the only one here prepared to criticise. Personally, I think you just got a little to confident and complacency set in.

I feel you should have given advice like this

Glad to see you got out unharmed guys, that was wild weather. I'm sure you have learnt a few lessons from it. I would advise buying a spare head-torch or bothy bag to carry with you in case a freak situation like this ever catches you out again. Lots of love from your best friend forever Dean1870

There's my input, anyone want to add to or have a dig at it?

[Rugged Track]

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