Topic: up Donard in an hour? (Read 48069 times)

twentyclicks · « **Reply #75 on:** October 15, 2012 »

You don't need to carb load for something like this. If you eat normally your regular glycogen stores will have enough for at least 90mins of intense activity. People 'hit the wall' or 'bonk' when they run out of bodily carb supply... this normally happens to marathon runners around mile 16-18 - which for most people is well over 2hrs. You would get by without even eating/drinking anything, but probably safe to have something with you at least incase you are delayed in the hills.

Oisin is also right in that most people who consider carb-loading do it wrong. Eating loads of pasta the night before will leave you bloated. It works best with athletes who routinely deplete their glycogen stores so their bodies are sensitive to it and efficient at filling it back up again. You then should deplete your reserves with some intensity or by lowering your carb intake 10-7 days before event, then start piling in the carbs (pros will consume up to 7-10g/kg body weight a day in this period). You also need to drink loads of water as it is needed to make the glycogen molecules. Combined with a taper in training volume this will ram their reserves with double the normal amount. The day before the event you should take it easier and avoid fibre to rest your system, then fuel during the race with easily digestible carb sources.

Beetroot is also showing signs of being effective supplement to improve aerobic performance. Many cyclists are naturally/legally-doping on beetroot juice.

Anyway - if you are doing more than a half-marathon you could consider carb-loading as above, but it's really unnecessary for most people. You will likely not feel the best or just put on weight. Easier to just top up with a few sweets or a gel if you feel you are flagging.

twentyclicks · « **Reply #76 on:** October 15, 2012 »

Forgot to add - as Oisin mentioned you may feel you have less energy... this is because the mega pasta feed will cause a big insulin spike that will overcompensate and leave your blood sugars low.

The Tour de France riders may eat loads of carbs at dinner each night, but they are burning 6000 a day and are well used to it. Even doing multi-day treks you can eat a horse each night...the body needs it so bad the downsides don't seem to materialise....it uses it all.

Rusty Madra · « **Reply #77 on:** October 15, 2012 »

Good stuff: sounds definitive enough for me. Wasn't being awkward it just winds me up when there's so many schools of thought knocking about all sounding credible.

The best example of this I find all the time is when people kick off with the old "They say...." Before making crazy statements

I once had a guy say to me "They say you can bend the trajectory of a bullet by putting a spin on it"

My response was a swift: "who's they?" followed by "you've been watching Wanted haven't you?" .... There was a denial followed by an embarrassed silence and then a meek ... "yeah... "

Oisín · « **Reply #78 on:** October 15, 2012 »

And where did you get your PHD in nutrition again Craig? Your knowledge always blows me away.

Would I be close to the truth if I said that "carb loading" is one of these things someone has took from a professional athlete's training regime and thought, "if I do that too I'll be like them, even though I'm only going to be playing football for an hour down at the park."

Could we stretch it to say its similar to, or related even, to everyone all of a sudden everyone buying Whey and Protein supplements and thinking this will make me a body builder.

In my head its all just marketing mumbo jumbo.

mregan · « **Reply #79 on:** October 15, 2012 »

I have been watching this thread thinking I wouldn't mind a timed run up Donard.

The weekend as part of The wall Duathlon I got the chance. I was injured but thought I would give it a go anyway. We were using Si Dibber timing so I didn't have to look at the time. Before reaching Donard we started at silent valley, ran up the steep grassy bank of the dam then a 3km trail run around silent valley nature trails. (16:03) Onto the bike and cycled the 20km along head road onto the main road to Donard park. (43:11) My time for Donard started on the main road as I turned into the car park. Total time at this point was (59:14) I racked the bike took off the bike shoes, helmet and put on trail shoes time still running. Started running from the the entrance of the carpark killkeel rd side. We ran the river trail all the way up. Right to left to right of the river. Then up the glen river path. Total time at the saddle (01:50:15) Then up the steps to the summit (02:10:41) I stopped for a few photos on the way up too.

On the way down I was slow. I was in a lot of pain and couldn't get up to speed. Total time at the saddle (02:18:15) then time back at the carpark (02:56:14)

Transition and back onto the bike to cycle out through bryansford, slievenaman road up past spelga and back to Silent valley (04:31:23) I had to call it a day at this point and didn't do the final 13km run. I am gutted not to have finished the full course but my back was gone.

twentyclicks · « **Reply #80 on:** October 15, 2012 »

Well done regan! It sounds beastly enough without an injury.

Oisin, I just amass information when I look into stuff that interests me. I do have some biology and PE qualifications a long time ago, but mainly got into nutrition a few years ago to counter fatigue...and now that I'm into ultra-running and have experience of long-distance treks it all is of interest...some I agree with, some I don't, and some I do but am not ready for yet! Probably the main books I've picked up fitness and nutrition info from are...
The Primal Blueprint, Racing Weight, Body by Science, Relentless Forward Progress, 4-Hour Body, Trail Life, & Book of the Bivvy.

I view whey as a 'protein gel'... it provides easy optimal intake, and it can be cost effective as meat & fish are expensive and you may not believe beans to be that optimal or good for eating in large quantities.

Sorry your thread has been hijacked Liam, we should maybe move these posts to a 'carb-loading' thread?

Quote from: Oisín on October 15, 2012

And where did you get your PHD in nutrition again Craig? Your knowledge always blows me away.

Would I be close to the truth if I said that "carb loading" is one of these things someone has took from a professional athlete's training regime and thought, "if I do that too I'll be like them, even though I'm only going to be playing football for an hour down at the park."

Could we stretch it to say its similar to, or related even, to everyone all of a sudden everyone buying Whey and Protein supplements and thinking this will make me a body builder.

In my head its all just marketing mumbo jumbo.

SteLad · « **Reply #81 on:** October 17, 2012 »

Hi there
Glad I stumbled across this thread as I am currently in ther midst of this challenge myself with another friend.
We are having another attempt this Sunday 21st Oct. I am hoping to get under 1hr 5m which would be a new PB for me, My firend has a good chance of breaking the hour, conditions permitting.

Will post our times on monday, but interestingly we use the same markers - 3rd Bridge, bottom of staircase, cairn at the saddle, summit.

The target for one hour being 15,17,11,17

fingers crossed
Ste

madmickie · « **Reply #82 on:** October 17, 2012 »

Interesting read on this. I was up SD in about 1hr10 during the 7 7s. Knocking the 10 off would be tricky enough and would have to come mostly off the flatter section before steps to col.

I was wondering what route you take up the river. Dunno if the following is any different but it might save a little time

1. Go right at the first bridge and continue up the road for 150-200m. There is a path to your left just as the roads turns hard right. Follow to next road.

2. Ahead and slightly left pick up another path that leads through the trails to the next road. These trails can be deep mud in parts. Reach the next path.

3. Straight on to nice open forest path that brings you to the wall but instead of going left to the rocky path - veer slight right to gap in wall to pick up another path. This is parallel to the rocky path until to come to a small open grassy airy just before the gap in the forest. Cut left to the main path here.

1 and 3 should offer some small saving. Not sure about 2 as I never seem to be able to take the same trail twice.

LandyLiam · « **Reply #83 on:** October 17, 2012 »

Quote

I was wondering what route you take up the river. Dunno if the following is any different but it might save a little time

I've tried many routes up the river, and i've ended up using the tourist route beside the river on all my latest attempts, basically its a lot drier, and straighter, and there is the odd wee flat bit you can jog, the forest route is too slippy (i use road running trainers for donard) and i lose time circumnavigating obstacles. One downside though is that during afternoon attempts you have to wade through the hoards of descenders, mornings are fine though, not many coming down at 10am

the only deviation i use is about half way bewteen 2nd & 3rd bridge i veer right into the forset where there is a little stream to cross, then there a good track upwards there (through the fallen trees).

I've always used the main path after the 3rd bridge, have been tempted to try the one in the forest, but never wanted to waste an attempt by getting lost

LandyLiam · « **Reply #84 on:** October 21, 2012 »

MISSION ACCOMPLISHED

1st checkpoint @ 3rd bridge: 14 mins

2nd checkpoint @ river crossing: 32.5 mins (section time 18.5mins)

3rd checkpoint @ saddle cairn: 43.25 mins (section time 11.75 mins, again i'm getting slower on this bit, must be becasue i pushed hard on the last section)

4th checkpoint @ the summit: 1hr 20secs, rounded off to an hour of course

(section time 17 mins)

it was like the inside of a ping pong ball at the summit so i rested for 4 mins then jogged back down giving me a total time of 1hr57mins (53 mins down), then met a friend and started back up again

only to the second bridge though

surfnscenic · « **Reply #85 on:** October 21, 2012 »

Well done. You sure are a glutton for punishment. How are they legs and I suppose the rest of you?

phil_b · « **Reply #86 on:** October 21, 2012 »

If that was me i wouldn't be happy with actually being over the hour even if it was only 20 seconds

I would be trying again!

madmickie · « **Reply #87 on:** October 21, 2012 »

maybe as you go higher time goes more slowly so an hour and 20 secs is really just an hour!!

LandyLiam · « **Reply #88 on:** October 21, 2012 »

oh i'm well happy with my time

i'll put the 20secs down to stopping to let a few groups past on the narrow section, and stepping aside to avoid that mountain biker coming down the glen river path trying to get 88mph to activate his flux capacitor

Quote

How are they legs and I suppose the rest of you?

thats the great bit, i don't feel a thing, after doing donard 4 weekends in a row i've now got a good set of mountain legs

i did have a sore back when i started (thanks to lifting a piano last night) but the pain seemed to mysteriously disappear by the first bridge

SteLad · « **Reply #89 on:** October 22, 2012 »

There were 4 of us attempted this on Sunday morning at 9.am - we timed as follows

Jon 54.30 (13.15, 29.19, 39.20, 54.30)
Ste 58.20 (13.35, 30.42, 42.17, 58.20) **Me
Mar 1.02
Dav 1.07

Dont know the other 2 lads split times.

In summary - the biggest gain over my last times was part jogging / fast marching the first section up to the 3rd bridge i gained a minute and a half on this section vs my target of 15 mins - the second section i was 17.12 section time which was about right against my target of 17 this was part walked / part jogged. I was a little slower on the staircase than hoped. The main thing which got me under the hour was sheer bloody-mindedness on the last section, I was close to vomiting a few times and was pulling myself up with my arms using the wall on one or two parts but pleased to put this to bed at my 5th attempt. I was right on the limit of stamina and willpower and hence I am in no rush to do this again anytime soon!

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Author Topic: up Donard in an hour? (Read 48069 times)

twentyclicks

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twentyclicks

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Rusty Madra

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Oisín

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mregan

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twentyclicks

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SteLad

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madmickie

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LandyLiam

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LandyLiam

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surfnscenic

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phil_b

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madmickie

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LandyLiam

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SteLad

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